The Tranquil Templar

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The Tranquil Templar

Postby Balgin Stondraeg » Fri Mar 30, 2012 3:09 pm

Something I've been mulling over for a while now, and possibly considering as a plot to use in the future, is that of combining the calm and level headed inhuman persona of the tranquil with the duty of the templar. This would be as an npc, obviously. Not a player character. I can see it a number of different ways.

1: A particularly devout mage really wants to be a templar. The order refuse him (obviously) and he offers to undergo the rite of tranquility rather than suffer the agony of being denied his dream as he fears his desire for the role would leave him open to posession by a demon and that would go against everything he stands for.

2: An experienced templar sees that some within the order are becoming unneccessarily prejudiced against mages. He requests to undergo the rite of tranquility because he believes it would allow hm to have an unbiased outlook, make him a better judge of things. He truly believes it would make him a more effective templar. His request is probably denied since I doubt the chantry would be willing to perform the rite on anyone not considered a mage.

Yes, I know Bioware broke all the rules in Dragon Age 2 when they started letting demons posess templars but I'm conveniently ignoring that for now (probably because I'd prefer to set any adventures I run before the whole DA2 debacle takes place).

3: A young templar initiate is discovered to be a flegdling mage. Shocked that one could have infiltrated their order (probably, himself, uanware of his power) the chantry causes him to disappear and then resurface in some far flung corner of the world as a tranquil a few months later.

4: A tranquil, after many months, maybe even years, of consideration, comes to the conclusion that he would make a much more effective templar than those already doing the job. He petitions his superiors rather passively, only offering his opinion when asked and never speaking out of turn, 'till they have become so aware of his views that they ask him to explain his theory. His request is probably also refused but it might actualy be allowed to wear templar insignia and carry out some rather menial duties. The other templars might find his presence unsettling. The inspiration for this character might have been Isaac Asimov's robot detective from Caves of Steel.

So as I said, I've been mulling over this idea and these permutations for a while now so I thought I might offer them up to see what the rest of you thought of them.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby 5trangeCase » Fri Mar 30, 2012 3:20 pm

Lyrium is extremely harmful to mages. To have it coursing about your being and being addicted to it...I'm not sure.

And I'm not sure what you're talking about when you reference the "debacle" of demons possessing Templars. What I took from Origins is that anyone, anything in fact could be possessed by a demon. Just that they are particularly attracted to mages, and when they possess a mage they become an abomination. The Stone Prisoner is the most obvious example of this, as the desire demon says that it wants to possess this girl who is never referred to as having magical talent. If you're saying it's silly or unusual...the unusual is what Dragon Age is about.

That said, one would question whether a mage-blooded individual becoming a Templar is even possible. On the same note, could a Templar undergo the Rite of Tranquility? Would it survive?
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby ColdSteel1 » Fri Mar 30, 2012 4:21 pm

My brain just nearly exploded from the paradox of the tranquil templar. :o
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Balgin Stondraeg » Fri Mar 30, 2012 4:36 pm

ColdSteel1 wrote:My brain just nearly exploded from the paradox of the tranquil templar. :o


That's kind of the point. I'm not saying it should be possible. I'm saying that it's possible a character in Thedas might come up with the idea. I could, for example, have a villain guarded by tranquil dressed as templars in his wicked secret lair. She could even masquerade as a priestess and have her big silent emotionless templar bodyguard (no templar training - just Tranquil dressed up that she's hoping to somehow train).

Or, more insidiously, a villain capturing templars to subject them to his twisted version of the rite of tranquility (wich he's not very familiar with at all). Perhaps because they made his friend tranquil against his will. This twisted missunderstood vengeance story's probably the easiest to use but hey, maybe we can come up with some more ideas.

That said, one would question whether a mage-blooded individual becoming a Templar is even possible. On the same note, could a Templar undergo the Rite of Tranquility? Would it survive?


Those are the kind of things I'm pondering. Could anyone who's not a mage survive the rite of tranquility? What would happen if someone tried to perform the rite of tranquility on a dwarf? Would he say "Enchantment?"

I honestly could see one of those more bonkers dwarfs on the surface who've converted to the worship of Andraste and the Maker requesting to become tranquil even 'though there's no chance he could ever be a mage* so there's no need to perform the rite upon him. Hmm. I could even see a noble claiming their brother or sister was a mage to get them shut away in the circle to deny them their inheritance and then if the rite of tranquility failed to work on them because they were not a mage (and it simply burned them out and slew them) how might the templars view that? That the person was already posessed and the rite purged them of the wickedness that was all that remained? Probably. And they'd probably hush it up too but there would be an investigation. Perhaps even some chantry official discretely contacting a group of player characters and asking them to seek evidence of the deceased's supposed powers wich ahd never actualy manifested. And investigating their family.

* Yes, I know. "Not enchantment." :roll: But that's something we'll all have to wait and see about when it blatantly becomes obvious that there is one dwarf mage in Thedas and he is not the first.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby ColdSteel1 » Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:05 pm

It can be possible to use the Rite to prevent and/or exorcise demonic possession toward a templar and the chantry can say to anyone who asks that the reason said templar is acting weird because of symptoms of lyrium addiction which would cause more sympathy to the common people rather than admit the chantry's protectors are part of those creepy tranquil mages. IMO
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Balgin Stondraeg » Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:32 pm

Just to be clear I'm not imagining a tranquil with templar powers. I'm imagining one being able to serve as part of the order.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby ColdSteel1 » Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:45 pm

I suppose that such a individual might serve as a templar in the Tevinter Imperium as part of the Imperial Chantry not because to keep the magisters in line which would be sort of counterproductive but to drive home the fear to Circles in other nations of the fate of those mages (esp. those lousy Libertarians) who believe themselves outside of (Tevinter) authority. I mean what better person to hunt down apostates than those who are/were mages themselves esp. those who knows how rogue mages would think and react?
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Saisei » Sat Mar 31, 2012 1:22 am

Interesting idea. Could you make a Tranquil Templar kind of like a Templar sniffer dog who can hunt down and track apostates/magic users? I imagine a Tranquil anything would be essentially useless in a fight but using them to track could work.

Oh and someone in our group who isn't a mage has been possessed by a demon so :P
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby 5trangeCase » Sat Mar 31, 2012 5:26 am

Can't Templars sense mages anyway? I could have sworn I read somewhere that they could at least instantly tell whether someone was a mage or not just by looking at them. That might just be intuition and not talent; and even if it were part of their powers, that doesn't necessarily mean they'd be able to track them down.

Generally though, don't Templars already have phylacteries to hunt down mages? I suppose they might need a hand hunting apostates, but the vibe I got with the Chantry Templars is that unless an apostate shows her/himself they don't bother trying to find them. I mean, it's common knowledge that the Dalish, the Avvar and the Chasind have a bunch of apostates and they just turn a blind eye to them.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby DracoDruid » Sat Mar 31, 2012 5:31 am

I think the problem with the tranquil is that they not only lose their emotions but also their ambitions.

And a templar without the ambition (or devotion) is of diminished use I'd say.

And about what templars can and can't, I really would have wished for a more clear concept both in the PC-games and the RPG.

Example: What about the Lyrium-Problem? There is nothing about it in the RPG.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Ghostdanser » Sat Mar 31, 2012 7:39 am

Dragon Age: Asunder has some interesting information on Tranquils. Take it or leave it as you please.

Without trying to give away too many spoilers....

Tranquils are not immune to possession...
Tranquility can be reversed...
Tranquils will disobey orders if there is a logical reason to disobey the orders. In other words you might be able to reason with them, but not on an emotional level. "Just the facts, mam."

While Tranquils may seem to lack ambition, if you assign them a task they will apply themselves to it fully...regardless of what the consequences might be. They might do things that others would consider to be insane and would never dream of doing...just because it was the only way the Tranquil knew of that would get results...so be careful of what you order a Tranquil to do...or at the very least be very careful in setting up boundaries.

Quite frankly I just don't believe the Templar Order (not individual Templars) would ever trust any mage, even a Tranquil, enough to make them a Templar...lyrium issues aside.

But I gotta say...a very cool "what if?" concept....it might have potential usage for a story with an npc mage striving to become a Templar (with potential help from the pc's)...being faced with the Tranquility option...and in the end it proves to be ultimately for naught. A very Dragon Age kind of story.

*pondering* :idea:
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby shonuff » Sat Mar 31, 2012 2:10 pm

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:Yes, I know Bioware broke all the rules in Dragon Age 2 when they started letting demons posess templars but I'm conveniently ignoring that for now (probably because I'd prefer to set any adventures I run before the whole DA2 debacle takes place).


How was it against the rules for demons to possess templars? I don't recall anything of the sort. Mages are the easiest for possession, but IIRC, anyone/thing is open.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Lynata » Wed Apr 04, 2012 6:36 am

5trangeCase wrote:On the same note, could a Templar undergo the Rite of Tranquility? Would it survive?
I see no reason why normal humans couldn't undergo the Rite of Tranquility as well. All it does is severing one's connection to the Fade. That mages stop being vulnerable to possession is just a side-effect of this, and the cause of why it's done to them but (usually) not anyone else.

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:Hmm. I could even see a noble claiming their brother or sister was a mage to get them shut away in the circle to deny them their inheritance and then if the rite of tranquility failed to work on them because they were not a mage (and it simply burned them out and slew them) how might the templars view that? That the person was already posessed and the rite purged them of the wickedness that was all that remained?
Ohh, like the abuse of lobotomy which is sometimes featured in various movies such as From Hell or Sucker Punch - an interesting idea, especially given that lobotomy likely was the writers' inspiration for the Rite of Tranquility.

I don't think it would happen often, but it would be possible. We know that there are some corrupt templars, so all it takes is a combination of circumstances and a bribe, with said templar then convincing the other knights that the innocent victim really is a possessed mage, possibly by simply telling them he saw it.

Don't see a reason for why the Rite would fail, though - but I think there's potential for an interesting crime adventure in here? :)

5trangeCase wrote:I mean, it's common knowledge that the Dalish, the Avvar and the Chasind have a bunch of apostates and they just turn a blind eye to them.
I think this is more because even the templars cannot be everywhere, and trying to storm an Avvar village is trouble that Ferelden can ill afford. It's the same reason for why they don't do anything about the heresy going on in Tevinter. Limited resources.

I'm sure they'd like to round up all Shamans, Keepers and Magisters if they could, but they've got their hands full policing the Andrastean realms already. Which is not to say that I couldn't ever imagine a small army of templars raiding a Dalish camp or wilder settlement, mind you. Whether or not they'd bother mustering the necessary manpower would very much depend on what they hear about them, though.
"There's a bunch of Dalish moving through the woods" just doesn't warrant as much attention as "there's an elven mage doing weird things to the trees near our village!"

DracoDruid wrote:And a templar without the ambition (or devotion) is of diminished use I'd say.
This is a good point - faith and zeal to strengthen the templar against what he is to face seem to be regarded as requirements, in addition to loyalty and skill-at-arms.

On the other hand, a Tranquil is unable to feel fear in the first place, which does count for something as well. And his lack of emotions would surely make him even more efficient and loyal than many of the "more human" and thus "fallible" templars.

In the end, I do believe it would be possible to have a Tranquil serving the Templar Order rather than the Circle, possibly even wearing their insignia, yet I wouldn't call him a templar. He'd rather be an "adopted asset", much like Meredith's little maid.

Notice how Elsa wears a Chantry cleric's robes? I think she is a perfect example for how I'd pull off a Tranquil serving the templars. Chantry robes, a chamber within the garrison, and an official post with duties directly tied to the order. The Tranquil could even act like some sort of "detective" walking around with a templar squad to sniff out apostate hideouts and try to solve crimes involving magic. After all, as has been said, who would know a mage's work better than another mage?

In fact, this does remind me of a certain movie ...

Image

:P

Ghostdanser wrote:Tranquils are not immune to possession...
Although it should probably be pointed out that this specific case required a special location as well as the Tranquil being ordered to engage in experiments involving the summoning of spirits. Whilst the process could be replicated, I don't think it is likely to happen randomly - there's a reason the Chantry trusted the Rite for several centuries, and this event was an intentionally created first-timer.

shonuff wrote:How was it against the rules for demons to possess templars? I don't recall anything of the sort. Mages are the easiest for possession, but IIRC, anyone/thing is open.
Indeed, there were a few possessed templars in DA:O as well.

The big difference is that mages can get possessed at any time, whereas others can only get possessed if they are subjected to strong demonic corruption in the real world, which simply doesn't happen very often. They are immune in the Fade (due to not being conscious there), but once a demon has broken through the Veil and has taken solid form it can interact with people and use magic to break their minds. In DA2, the blood mages were using an arcane ritual to trap the aforementioned templars and make them vulnerable for possession in order act as vessels for demons they summoned for specifically this event: http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Tarohne

"I knew he was involved in something sinister, but this ... is it even possible? Normally we only worry that mages will fall victim to possession. I have heard of blood mages or demons in solid form who could summon others into unwilling hosts."
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Balgin Stondraeg » Thu Apr 05, 2012 4:59 am

Lynata wrote:
5trangeCase wrote:
shonuff wrote:How was it against the rules for demons to possess templars? I don't recall anything of the sort. Mages are the easiest for possession, but IIRC, anyone/thing is open.
Indeed, there were a few possessed templars in DA:O as well.

The big difference is that mages can get possessed at any time, whereas others can only get possessed if they are subjected to strong demonic corruption in the real world, which simply doesn't happen very often. They are immune in the Fade (due to not being conscious there), but once a demon has broken through the Veil and has taken solid form it can interact with people and use magic to break their minds. In DA2, the blood mages were using an arcane ritual to trap the aforementioned templars and make them vulnerable for possession in order act as vessels for demons they summoned for specifically this event: http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Tarohne


I don't recall there being any posessed templars in origins. Dominated, yes. Controlled, yes. Posessed? I don't think so. I could be mistaken.

In DA2 they started breaking all the rules allowing any mage that wasn't player controlled to teleport (magic can't teleport), allowing non mages to be posessed (only mages can be posessed) all sorts of DA immersion breaking stuff for silly manga fight style for console gamers :(. In a way I'm almost surprised they didn't go all out, let mages fly and constantly raise the dead.

I should imagine a tranquil templar in action would be more like The Agent from Serenity (& therefore, by extension, Firefly). His calm and peaceful demeanour as he does the government's dirty work and believe's he's making the world a better place. This could tie in with the one or two references to mages outside the tower being accompanied by tranquil warriors as bodyguards. Anyone unfortunate enough to watch them fight would probably be terrified by the incredibly emotionless and impersonal way they went about their business.

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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Elfie » Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:09 am

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:In DA2 they started breaking all the rules allowing any mage that wasn't player controlled to teleport (magic can't teleport)


Wait, what? Who? When? If you're talking about Flemmeth, that was explicitly not teleportation. The Champion carries "a piece" of her to the Free Marches, which then manifests into an aspect of her full being. She comments that only being in one place at a time would be too restrictive. So, Flemmeth can be in more than one place at a time, but she has to physically go there (or be taken there), but that's definitely not teleportation.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Lynata » Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:51 am

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:I don't recall there being any posessed templars in origins. Dominated, yes. Controlled, yes. Posessed? I don't think so. I could be mistaken.
http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Possessed_Templar

Don't worry, they're easy to forget. Aside from the NPCs having this name tag I do not believe this was ever touched upon in more detail in DA:O. But it fits to what Cullen said in DA2. ;)

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:I should imagine a tranquil templar in action would be more like The Agent from Serenity (& therefore, by extension, Firefly). His calm and peaceful demeanour as he does the government's dirty work and believe's he's making the world a better place.
Ooh, another good example. :)
I mainly referenced Equilibrium because the grammaton clerics were devoid of any human emotion as well, thanks to the Prozium drug. Also, the meaning of the very name of the movie is somewhat similar to Tranquility, heh.

As for teleportation magic: I could actually deem it possible - albeit surely not as an everyday spell. We know that you can, in theory, bring your body into the Fade (it has been done once), so all it takes for a teleportation would be to jump in and out of it, arriving at a different place when you step out again.
And now I get all sorts of memories about Event Horizon. :D
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Balgin Stondraeg » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:22 am

Lynata wrote:I mainly referenced Equilibrium...


Wich I haven't seen....

Elfie wrote:
Balgin Stondraeg wrote:In DA2 they started breaking all the rules allowing any mage that wasn't player controlled to teleport (magic can't teleport)


Wait, what? Who? When? If you're talking about Flemmeth, that was explicitly not teleportation. The Champion carries "a piece" of her to the Free Marches, which then manifests into an aspect of her full being. She comments that only being in one place at a time would be too restrictive. So, Flemmeth can be in more than one place at a time, but she has to physically go there (or be taken there), but that's definitely not teleportation.


No Elfie, I didn't mean Flemeth. That one actualy made sense. What I meant was ..... (see below).

As for teleportation magic: I could actually deem it possible - albeit surely not as an everyday spell. We know that you can, in theory, bring your body into the Fade (it has been done once), so all it takes for a teleportation would be to jump in and out of it, arriving at a different place when you step out again.
And now I get all sorts of memories about Event Horizon. :D


Yes. It works as a plot device. Unfortunately every single hostile mage in DA 2 having short ranged teleportation spells just broke the fun completely. Not only was it annoying but there were even journal & codex entries in game stating it was impossible. I tried and tried and tried to imagine they were temporarily becoming invisible and sneaking away for a short duration spell then reappearing but it just wasn't a very convincing lie when they just kept doing it (and clearly weren't sneaking through areas of effect or being affected by them in any way, shape or form).

I've always believed that it is the consciousness that travels into the Fade whilst the body remains behind. Hence Niall's body on the floor as the demon of Sloth feeds upon it to sustain the many nightmares that it weaves. I imagine that while the heroes are trapped within it's web their bodies remain in that chamber while it's feasting off them too.



I tend to think of that as a continuity breaking typo as they clearly aren't that posessed. More like controlled like puppets and apparently in Dragon Age posession means turning into an abomination despite what linguistics and history would suggest otherwise.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Lynata » Thu Apr 05, 2012 1:13 pm

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:Wich I haven't seen....
Oooh, if you ever get the chance (netflix?), do it - it's popcorn action trash, but it's enjoyable! And the setting is interesting. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlzXEw616Ho
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJf9Pf9rjO4

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:Unfortunately every single hostile mage in DA 2 having short ranged teleportation spells just broke the fun completely.
Huh, I did not even notice that. :oops:

David Gaider actually addresses it here: http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/3175198&lf=8#3180676

So I guess this "teleportation" in DA2 is more in line with what we see of Isabela's ability to pop out of nowhere in people's backs. Not perfect, but excusable.

Balgin Stondraeg wrote:I tend to think of that as a continuity breaking typo as they clearly aren't that posessed. More like controlled like puppets and apparently in Dragon Age posession means turning into an abomination despite what linguistics and history would suggest otherwise.
Not quite - even the DA P&P mentions the puppet factor as it explains possession as being one of the dangers of magic:

"An abomination is created. This is the name given to mages who have been possessed by demons. This is not a physical possession—the demon is still in the Fade, but so is the mage’s spirit, and the demon twists and controls the mage’s body through that captive spirit. The demon sees through the body’s eyes, channels its power through it and is able to use that body’s magic in ways the mage would never have imagined. [...] The more powerful the demon, the worse the abomination [...]"

So, from what I've gathered throughout all the books and games, a demon managing to sneak into a host always possesses the body, but it doesn't always turn it into an abomination right away. At least not in the visible sense. Rather, it seems as if demons/spirits have a tendency to transform stuff they meet in the real world into what they know from the twisted impressions they gathered in the Fade, so a possessed body may or may not develop "demonic" features. How quickly this happens seems to vary, possibly depending on factors such as the demon/spirit controlling it or how tight the control is.

In "Asunder", the definition of abominations is broadened so far that it actually includes Anders and Wynne, even though both look perfectly normal. Then there is the possessed mage Pharamond who is described as an "elf with demonic features".

In DA2, there is also that possessed templar (victim of blood magic ritual) who turns into an abomination (the monstrous kind) as he is confronted by Cullen, so maybe this means the demon controlling the body tried to make it "stronger" or it just means that it took over completely (from merely influencing its victim before)?

Also, from the Scrolls of Banathor (DA:O Codex):
"Engage them in a battle of wills, and you will be successful. Should you fail, the power will be yours, but your body will belong to the demon. Relish this infernal power while it lasts, for once you are an abomination, your demon half will soon swallow your mind."

So there can be some sort of gap between becoming possessed and going 100% monster.

Maybe this will be further clarified in the future. :)
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Balgin Stondraeg » Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:51 am

Lynata wrote:So, from what I've gathered throughout all the books and games, a demon managing to sneak into a host always possesses the body, but it doesn't always turn it into an abomination right away. At least not in the visible sense. Rather, it seems as if demons/spirits have a tendency to transform stuff they meet in the real world into what they know from the twisted impressions they gathered in the Fade, so a possessed body may or may not develop "demonic" features. How quickly this happens seems to vary, possibly depending on factors such as the demon/spirit controlling it or how tight the control is.


I personaly prefer posession not turning people into obvious demon monsters straight away. I was very disappointed with the blatant mutation in Stolen Throne when the mage was posessed (and the body instantly reverting back afterwards).

In "Asunder", the definition of abominations is broadened so far that it actually includes Anders and Wynne, even though both look perfectly normal. Then there is the possessed mage Pharamond who is described as an "elf with demonic features".


That wasn't broadened. Anders was already considered an abomination in DA2. People labelling Wynne an abomination in Asunder is more open to interpretation. I think there might have even been a conversation tiopic to discuss wether she was an abomination or not in Origins.

In DA2, there is also that possessed templar (victim of blood magic ritual) who turns into an abomination (the monstrous kind) as he is confronted by Cullen, so maybe this means the demon controlling the body tried to make it "stronger" or it just means that it took over completely (from merely influencing its victim before)?


yes there is and that's when they started breaking all the rules. That and all the teleport/super jump manga nonsense they put in the game for mechanical reasons rather than common sense. You should never come up with a rule then find a way of forcing it into your game. If you do then you'll end up with some travesty like WFRP 3rd edition! You should come up with an idea then build the rule to fit it.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Lynata » Sat Apr 07, 2012 8:38 am

Ah, I don't even recall Wynne having this "problem" in DA:O already - then again, my interaction with her was rather limited as I mostly went with Alistair, Leliana and Morrigan. Honestly thought they have retconned this until now.

I still don't see why the possession of non-mages should break some rule when said rule did not exist before. I do agree about the superjump FX stuff, however - this sort of nigh-cartoonish exaggeration was one of my major gripes with DA2.

At least the "Awesome Button" made it into its own meme amongst the community... :P

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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Balgin Stondraeg » Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:51 am

Lynata wrote:Ah, I don't even recall Wynne having this "problem" in DA:O already - then again, my interaction with her was rather limited as I mostly went with Alistair, Leliana and Morrigan. Honestly thought they have retconned this until now.


Nope. Alistair, Leliana & Wynne plus a main character was the most powerful & balanced party you could have in Origins. Wynne was just a super powerful healing machine. Alistair could tank (if you raised his "dump statted" constitution - a recurring feature in all Bioware games) and Leliana offered ranged support without needing to run over to people - although she could do that too.

You could discuss Wynne's posession as early as during the tower quests. The spirit that had fused itself with her was more benevolent and supporting and was made out in Asunder. Kind of like how Justice was a good spirit before it merged with Anders and became an angry vengeful thing. The spirit was one that Wynne had encountered in the Fade before. She had always sensed it watching over her, protective and caring. When she was nearly defeated in the tower the spirit entered into her and gave her the power to continue and become the Petrification & stonefist autokill combo for enemy mages and healbot that she is :p.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Lynata » Sun Apr 08, 2012 8:14 am

Man, seems like I really missed something there! In that case I'm glad Asunder explains it in detail, though.

I mainly took Morrigan along because I just couldn't resist the party banter. She may have only been a so-so healer, but together with Cone of Ice she made for excellent support still - and it was just too good to listen to her sarcastic remarks concerning the other party members. :D
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Deirain » Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:52 am

David Gaider wrote:Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.



He also went to state that when breaking the rules of an established world, it's okay to do as long as the event is considered significant and world-changing. He also stated that the Cardinal Rules of Magic are the rules as they are currently known, alluding to the fact that anything can, and most likely would, change. Calling foul every time the creator of a fantasy world changes his own creation is like telling a scientist that everything he has done to prove or disprove what is commonly accepted as scientific fact is rule-breaking and therefore not allowed.

The Earth is not the center of the universe nor is it flat, ladies and gentlemen. Someday a mage in Thedas will discover true teleportation, the Tevinter Imperium physically entered the Fade, and while Flemeth isn't actually immortal, she's damn close to it.
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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Hellebore » Mon Apr 09, 2012 5:28 am

Arl Eamon's son Connor was possessed by a desire demon and yet not abominated in any way. He maintained his normal physical form even though he occasionally broke out in demon voice and/or glowed a bit. http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Connor

Kitty in Honleath is also possessed by a desire demon yet still looks like a normal cat and isn't mutated like other demon possessed creatures (eg Sylvans). http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Kitty

You can let Amalia be possessed by Kitty and she will appear like a normal human, with no physical mutations.

So there seems to be enough evidence that being possessed doesn't always turn you into a standard abomination.

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Re: The Tranquil Templar

Postby Ghostdanser » Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:37 am

Hellebore wrote:Kitty in Honleath is also possessed by a desire demon yet still looks like a normal cat and isn't mutated like other demon possessed creatures (eg Sylvans). http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Kitty


While I agree with argument that all abominations do not look alike, and that some will appear perfectly normal, I have to disagree with this part of the argument. Kitty is not a Desire Demon possessing a cat, so much as a summoned demon assuming a shape to decieve. I suspect it goes something like this, the Desire Demon sensed Amalia's desire to own a pet and/or a sense of lonliness, so the demon shapeshifts into kitty to trick the girl into accepting her and trying to help her escape. On a rational level the girl has to know that cat's do not talk, but after a bit of mental manipulation it is perfectly acceptable that the cat talks and that kitty is her friend. Ultimately though it is not a case of possession...and don't ask me why this is the only demon that has shown the ability to shape change in the real world...it just gets added to the list of things we don't know yet. Maybe it has something to do wiith how long it was summoned for...maybe being here so long allowed it to adapt fade abilities to the real world...but that is pure speculation on my part.
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